(rtd) and currently the Chairman of the Police Service Commission
(PSC). Recently, the Presidential Committee on Police Reform which he
chaired submitted their report to the President, where they
recommended the scrapping of the Ministry of Police Affairs.
The super cop in this interview with Saturday Vanguard, spoke on their
recommendations and also hinted that police officers are being trained
now on counter terrorism. He also spoke on other issues.
Your recommendation that the Ministry of Police Affairs should be
scrapped have been received with mixed feelings from some quarters,
what motivated your committee's decision on that issue?
Let me tell you, our recommendations were not based on sentiments but
what is good for the nation. For instance, if you go to Gombe, they
have finished the whole police institution there. Yobe was empty when
I visited there. I have toured all these places but I don't think the
Minister has. If they went on tour, they would be able to know how to
organize the buildings, they would know the type of vehicles they
required there. Has the Minister ever been to Yenagoa or Obudu, but we
have policemen in all these places?
You cannot just sit down and be awarding contracts and the Inspector
General of Police does not know. So I am not against the Ministry of
Police Affairs but what I said in my report is that the Police Service
Commission (PSC), according to the 1999 Constitution made a trilateral
arrangement for the administration of the police. One, the Police
Council is made up of the President and chairman of the council, all
the Governors of the Federating states as members and the IG as
member. But that Council has never done its function according to the
constitution other than to come once in three or four years to sit
down and recommend the appointment of a new Inspector General of
Police, then they go back to sleep,whereas they should be meeting
three, four times a year to discuss how the police should be
governed,discuss the police problem and discuss police finances. If
there were meetings like that, this would have doused the clamour for
a state police because every body will now bring their problems at the
meeting. So when we talk about governance of the police, the Police
Council must meet and discuss the problems of the police. If they
meet, then they will be able to manage the police properly which at
the moment is sustaining the unity of the country.
Why are we crying of state police? The money you will aggregate under
one head to enhance the performance of the police, you now want to cut
it into pieces. States cannot fund the police, we knew what happened
so many years back, how the government in power will use Local
Government Police to arrest their political opponents. The truth is
that in a federal set up, ideally, there should be state and Local
Government Police, but we are not politically mature. That is my own
argument. You can see how our politicians behave even with the powers
they have now. And what will happen if two states have conflict? You
will see that both states will use their state police to start war.
Besides, most advanced countries like America and Britain are now
centralizing their police force in view of the new development in
crime like terrorism, like cyber crime. Therefore, there must be an
organ that will tackle that problem. So once we are ready, we will go
for State Police but for now, we are not just ready.
But the impression is that the Police Service Commission (PSC) wants
to take charge of contract awards and that was the reason for
recommending the scrapping of Ministry of Police Affairs?
That is rubbish. Just go and look at the recommendations. I am telling
you that there are three bodies. I only handle recruitment, discipline
and promotion, that is all. That does not involve money or contracts.
Before my Commission was established, was it not you journalists that
were writing about policemen complaining about promotion. Are they
still crying now? Now if you are qualified for promotion, you get it
without knowing any body. I have been promoting people without knowing
them. Once you are due for promotion and then you do your job well,
you will be promoted. Who is thinking that the Police Service
Commission wants to be awarding contracts, that is nonsense. It is not
a fight between the PSC and the Ministry of Police Affairs, we are
fighting for a good Force for the whole country. You did not talk when
an Assistant Commissioner of Police that I promoted to Deputy
Commissioner as the Chairman of the EFCC, who was working under the IG
but now earns more than the IG. You think such things are normal, he
is on N1.5million while the IG is on about N700,000 and some fraction
and you people will not talk.
A small boy that I promoted just because he was transferred from A to
B, he is now earning more than the IG, the same thing with the SSS,
all these people were part and parcel of the police. There are people
who deliberately killed the police and they are trying to make the
country ungovernable today. Why don't you ask the governors why they
want state police, because they want to be more powerful, to use them
against their political opponents.
Don't you see when the governorship campaign was going on in Edo
state, politicians were accusing each other every day. If there was a
state police, you can imagine what would have happened. But if they
allow the Police Council to operate, they can now bring their
grievances there and resolve it themselves.
But why this ceaseless conflicting reports between the SSS and the
police, particularly on the issue of the killing of Olaitan Oyerinde,
Governor Adams Oshiomhole's Private Secretary?
The SSS should not be heard, they should neither be seen nor be heard.
They are supposed to operate clandestinely, gather information,
intelligence, distill and authenticate and pass them to the
appropriate authority for use. This new trend where everybody comes
and arrests and also prosecutes is very bad. Needless schism among
security agencies is wrong.
If you get the information, pass it to the appropriate authority.
Everybody wants to be seen. That was what caused the 9/11 tragedy in
America. It is not that they did not have the information but some
security agencies were hoarding the information and did not pass it to
others. That is rubbish. Once you get the information, pass it to the
appropriate quarters. If it is the Army, give it to them and if it is
the police, give it to them also.
But a lot of Nigerians have more confidence in the SSS than the Police
because the police is seen as one body that can easily be compromised?
Who does not compromise in this country? Look, we are trying to reform
the police because we agreed that the system was rotten. But you
people always come with a set mind including the press. We are talking
about reforming the police now and you are talking about people
compromising.
There are bad eggs every where. Even since MD Abubakar came, are there
no changes in the police but I have not read any editorial about it.
You must encourage them. It is your police. Look at the poor girl they
murdered the other day, it did not take the police one week to get
them and we are now getting reports unlike before. Yes, I know that
the police used to be bad but they are improving now. We want to
return the force to their past glory. We have sent our report to the
Federal Government and Mr President has set up a committee to write
the white paper and one of the recommendations is that he should also
set up an implementation Committee so that they will see to the
implementation of the report to the end. You can see that the
implementation of the report has started, you will observe that the
police of today was not like this one year ago.
But we still don't have the number of policemen that will effectively
police the entire nation?
Yes, let them go and get the Police Colleges right. That is what the
Ministry of Police Affairs should have done so that they can create a
conducive learning environment for police officers and then we produce
gentlemen as policemen. Instead of training them like dogs, let them
build Police Colleges. I can't send people to Police College to go and
train when the learning environment is not conducive. That is even
part of the problem we have. My job is only to recruit police men and
train them but it is the Ministry that handles that money for
policemen. The Ministry does not know how many people I recruit, so
how will they know how much the police need. For instance, Mr
President has approved the establishment of a police university, it is
on- going. They have started writing papers but they did not know the
number of people we are going to recruit. Now, they will go and award
the contracts for the building and they will not tell the IG.
No body bothers to know the quality and the people who awarded the
contracts; don't visit there. Why must it be the police alone that the
Ministry will now be running their money?The Chief of Army Staff
manages the funds of the Army; Immigration does the same and Prisons,
except the Police. Police is the whipping boy, why must it be so?
But are you not worried that the police still cannot handle some
situations unless the Army is drafted to save the situation?
I have ceased to worry. Drastic situation requires drastic measures.
At 76 ,I don't worry any more but I know that the police will get
better. We have our operational mandate.
The last line of defense in any democratic setting is the police, we
manage acts of internal insurrection. If the police fails, then we
write to the Army to come and take over, that is the standing mandate.
We don't tackle these problems over night, we have people training
specially on terrorism now. You see, when you encounter new
developments in crime, you strategize. And don't forget, when you say
terrorism, these people are our brothers and sisters too. All we have
to do is to negotiate with them. Look at what Yar'Adua did with the
Niger Delta militants, he negotiated and we are enjoying peace there
today. No body wants destruction, we want peace.
But specifically what is the number of policemen in the country today?
We have about 350,000, the highest employer of labour in Africa,
perhaps in the whole world. Before we came in, people were crying of
promotion but today, nobody is complaining that his junior was
promoted above him, we have stopped such illicit acts.
The purpose of our reform is to ensure that the police is well
motivated and we have submitted our report and Mr President assured us
that he is going to do something positive and he is already doing some
thing. He has already appointed a committee to do the white paper. I
told you people that the Nigerian police is the least paid in the
whole of West Africa. Why should that be? And we are oil rich nation.
Take a visit to the police barracks and you will see where human
beings live. When you are dehumanized, the tendency is that you want
to take it back to the society and you become violent your self. So we
want to change all that and we must change it.
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